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Topic: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
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zoeyk

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Registered: Mar 4, 2007
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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 12:27 AM

Can we just ask people?

Scire hostis animum - Intelligere ludum - Nosce te ipsum - Prima moventur conciliat - Nolite errare

watsu

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 12:36 AM

Well, 7 and 8 have already split their set and no other games are completed there. Probably both of them are hoping to advance to the next round by sweeping the third player. But, yeah go ahead and ask them if you want.

I don't want to play non tournament rules games. If you take one of my unrated invites, play tourney
zoeyk

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 12:45 AM

How would you phrase the explanation and question to them?

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watsu

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 12:46 AM

Me? I wouldn't touch it. I'd vote for my idea.
My idea in full:
Advance the #2 seed as Karl and any clear second place finisher from section two. If there's no clear second place finisher, advance both players tied for second and third places from section two.
Advance the #4 seed as Zoeyk and the number #11 seed as rainwolf from section 4.
Assuming you and madhippo both sweep coffeboy, advance madhippo and Richard from section 5, assuming Rich places first or second in section one. Don't touch the rest...


Message was edited by: watsu at Jul 19, 2020, 1:00 AM

I don't want to play non tournament rules games. If you take one of my unrated invites, play tourney
zoeyk

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 12:48 AM

Hot potato I see, here karl, catch!

Scire hostis animum - Intelligere ludum - Nosce te ipsum - Prima moventur conciliat - Nolite errare
zoeyk

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 1:20 AM

I will sweep coffee boy. I have sure win in both games.

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watsu

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 1:25 AM

As I would expect. The rest, I expect as well, except I'm not certain who or how many will advance from section two besides Karl.

I don't want to play non tournament rules games. If you take one of my unrated invites, play tourney
watsu

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 4:44 AM

If either of Karl's suggestions are implemented, I think we end up with a section facing Richiii which is going to feel like they got the smelly end of the stick. If anyone felt like they were totally going to do well against me, Karl, or Zk but were given the smelly end because they ended up facing Karl, Zk or Rich instead in the second round... well, they could send an invitation for a rated set against the player they thought they'd do well against and put it to the test.

I don't want to play non tournament rules games. If you take one of my unrated invites, play tourney
pente_gon

Posts: 46
Registered: Dec 26, 2017
Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 9:04 AM

Below you can see my proposal for solving problem with playing against same players in consecutive rounds.

My proposal is to seed player into pots based on rating (as many pots as required number of players in sections) then to randomly place them into sections so that only one player from each pot can be located in one section.

Example for 11 players:
Pot A: (1,2,3)
Pot B: (4,5,6)
Pot C: (7,8,9)
Pot D: (10,11)
After drawing sections can look like:
Section 1: (2,6,7,10)
Section 2: (1,4,9,11)
Section 3: (3,5,8)

Of course it will be still possible that two players will play in same sections in consecutive rounds but it depends on random. Some sections can be stronger than other but it can happened in any seeding system.

rainwolf

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 10:59 AM

I like the idea of randomly shuffling the layers of each section. If every section produces 2 winners (and my math holds), I think pente_gon and R3 still have a 1/4 chance of meeting again.

Unless R3's rating jumps so high after this round that he's in the top 4, and thus in the same layer as pente_gon.
And that's if I reseed based on rating, which I'm not sure of yet. It seems reasonable, but that's only because no immediate downsides come to mind. Doesn't mean they're not there.

\_(ツ)_/
karlw

Posts: 946
Registered: Mar 7, 2006
From: Eugene, Oregon
Age: 32
Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 6:25 PM

I'll go on record as supporting pente_gon's plan.

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then.
watsu

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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 6:40 PM

Sounds like a good general plan for tourneys, so it has my vote too.

I don't want to play non tournament rules games. If you take one of my unrated invites, play tourney
zoeyk

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Registered: Mar 4, 2007
From: San Francisco
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Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 6:44 PM

cool, is that something rainwolf can do? any objections?

Scire hostis animum - Intelligere ludum - Nosce te ipsum - Prima moventur conciliat - Nolite errare
karlw

Posts: 946
Registered: Mar 7, 2006
From: Eugene, Oregon
Age: 32
Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 8:25 PM

It's still way too early to be certain, but I estimate there will be 15-17 players advancing to Round 2 (2-3 from Sections 2, 6 and 7, 2 from the remaining rounds). This means we will most likely have 4 sections in Round 2, but could very well have 5.

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then.
madmike

Posts: 110
Registered: May 27, 2014
From: Houston
Age: 66
Re: Pente Masters 2020: Solving the seed problem
Posted: Jul 19, 2020, 11:11 PM

if the current seeding hold true, i got for the last 8
pente_gon vs richardiii

watsu vs zoeyk

bewater vs spavacs

karlw vs madhippo

And yeah, r3 has to play against pente_gon a lot, But still seems like a finish I want to watch.

Next Time the "seed problem" should be solved before we start

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