Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 23, 2005, 10:27 AM
Okay, I have sent off the new and improved version of the poof pente puzzle to Dweebo, so expect to see it up soon(think basically like a chess problem only instead of chess, the game is Poof Pente). The puzzle is now known as the watsup2ng poof pente puzzle, thanks up2ng! I'm offering a $100 cash prize to the first person who sends me a correct solution to the new puzzle or alternatively, proves to my satisfaction that the puzzle has no solution or a different solution.
I say that best play* by both players leaves only two possible arrangements of P1's stones on the board and only one possible arrangement of P2's stones at the end of the game. P1 has once choice between 2 different moves, P2 may play stones in several different orders (in terms of which part of the line to play first) but has a single winning line. For those who just can't wait until Dweebo gets the puzzle page set back up, here is the board setup:
you can download both a pente and poof pente AI programs from this site: (you will need both, since the poof pente download opens up within the larger pente program)
If you use this approach, you can load the board position by cutting and pasting the following into a text document and then opening it up in the poof pente program.
* best play for P1= playing to prolong the game for as many moves as possible and seeking to capitalize on any potential mistakes by P2, also seeking to limit P2 to the minimum number of alternate ways to win as long as both the other conditions are also met. * best play for P2 = winning in the fewest possible number of moves, which I say is 26.
Posts:
118
Registered:
Dec 16, 2001
From:
cottage grove, oregon Home page
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 28, 2005, 9:00 PM
I am having a problem bringing up the poof pente download. I see that it is loaded into the same folder as wpente, but I can't locate it when I start wpente. What am I missing? Gaylen
Posts:
118
Registered:
Dec 16, 2001
From:
cottage grove, oregon Home page
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 28, 2005, 11:24 PM
OK. I copied poof pente into the wpente folder and was able to get it working. I typed in the puzzle and assume that defense takes over at move 37. If this is right, i.e., that it is now defenses move, then there is a problem. Can you spot it?
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 29, 2005, 1:59 AM
P2 is to play at move 37 and win in 26 moves, so offense is to play from that position. Hope this clarifies things for you. Also, both Mark Mammel and Up2ng have looked the puzzle over, so it seems to be accurate and workable as best we can tell. (i.e.- if you are still convinced there is a problem, convince me of it (in an email)and the $100 is yours)
Message was edited by: watsu at Jun 28, 2005 8:14 PM
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Posts:
118
Registered:
Dec 16, 2001
From:
cottage grove, oregon Home page
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 29, 2005, 11:51 AM
Relooked and there is no problem with the puzzle. Here is the solution that I came up with tonight. 37. C13 P19 38. O19 J19 39. K19 N15 40. M16 K12 41. 1J11 J12 42. L12 J14 Capture 43. L12 M10 44. M9 M13 This would be a total of 15 moves--by P2--beginning with the move P19. Win by five in a row.
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st correct solution
Posted:
Jun 29, 2005, 3:57 PM
There is a problem with your solution, which is this- 42.L12 is not best play for P1. I'm going to ask in future, however, that players send me an email rather than post their attempts to the forum. Thanks, Tom
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st solution
Posted:
Jul 2, 2005, 9:10 AM
Dumb ol' yahoo seems to be putting messages from DSG into my bulk mail folder lately, grr. Anyway, I've received several attempts now from 2 players and know of 2 more who are working on it, so there is some action happening. The best effort I've seen so far has placed 17 stones correctly for p2. I'll continue to monitor my bulk folder, but you can also send attempts directly to watsu13@(no spam)yahoo.com leaving out the (no spam). Good luck all! Tom
Message was edited by: watsu at Jul 2, 2005 3:11 AM
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st solution
Posted:
Jul 6, 2005, 3:27 AM
Okay, for those of you who can't get Mark Mammel's download, the puzzle position is now stored within the DSG games history database. Look under poof pente as the game with watsu as P1 and lepews as P2. Game date is July 4th, 2005. I want to be sure everyone who wants to try solving the puzzle has enough time, but am considering the possibility of setting a deadline just so that people will know that a solution will be revealed eventually. Still considering it as an option, but not sure. In any case, good luck and I hope to see a correct solution (or proof that one isn't possible) from someone soon. Tom
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st solution
Posted:
Jul 8, 2005, 4:27 AM
The puzzle has basically been solved by Gaylen (P2 wins in 26 moves solved), however, I'm still holding out on awarding the prize to him until I receive the exact line by p1 which forces a single winning line by p2 in 26 moves. It turns out that P1 has no options on play either, so there is a single unique optimal winning board layout. It seems unlikely that anyone will submit this before Gaylen does, however, should this unlikely event occur, I will award prize money to both Gaylen and the other person, so there is still a chance for you all, but you had better hurry! Tom
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st solution
Posted:
Jul 8, 2005, 7:11 AM
Congrats to Gaylen who has shown me the error of my ways. Turns out there is more than 1 way for P2 to win in 26 moves. Great job in persisting with it Gaylen! Tom
Retired from TB Pente, but still playing live games & exploring variants like D, poof and boat
Re: New and improved poof Pente puzzle; $100 prize for 1st solution
Posted:
Jul 8, 2005, 8:26 AM
Here's a slightly modified version of the above puzzle, it still solves in 26 moves, but with the modifications I think P1 can force it so that P2 has all 26 stones in place with a single exact pattern if best play is defined as winning in the fewest number of moves and with the fewest possible lost pairs within those moves. P1s stones can also fall into a single pattern if best play for P1 is defined as trying to win whenever possible, trying to prolong the game as long as possible, and trying to limit options for P2 and capture as many pairs as possible.
