Re: Open Challenge to All TB Pente Masters -- Financial Incentives
Posted:
May 31, 2026, 2:45 AM
Well, gomoku is a proven win for 1st player, is it doom and gloom for P2?
On one hand, I regularly perform simultaneous game sessions with non-professional players being strictly P2 and usually have 96% to 100% winrate. IRL, not online.
On the other hand, any player of high enough level will exterminate me easily... as well as I will.
Some years ago, in 80-s, people played set of two games. Then people invented "pro-gomoku" (current opening rule for pente on pente.org), then "swap gomoku" (first player puts 3 stones, second chooses colour), then after some theory research swap2 came into play, smth around late 00s. Now it is a balanced game. And the important thing is: people now play much, much better. When it was about finding a decisive attack from the opening, the playing style was pretty straight-forward, no positional play needed, just a brute force. "Pro-gomoku" rule didn't change it much; still there were some openings with P1 win -- as in Pente on pente.org now. But after swap2, starting positions became very, very different: some require force, some require positional ideas, some may give you advantage if you withstand a fierce but not clearly winning attack, and one can't memorize the way to equalize the position because there is a lot of openings so one has to learn how to do it better. That's how Gomoku (and Renju) developed since 80-s.
For now, the only thing that keeps "pro-pente" (pente.org rules) alive is some belief that there might be a complicated way for P2 to survive and cheat P1. The easiest way to remove this thing is a new research on the opening theory; I've wrote a big book on Renju opening theory ("Caged Tiger", 2015) so I know how to do it. Maybe one day I will do it in Pente =) At least I usually do some after-the-game analyses and record results; Pente is much-much easier than Renju so I doubt this task is too hard.
Re: Open Challenge to All TB Pente Masters -- Financial Incentives
Posted:
May 31, 2026, 2:50 AM
And sorry, I didn't mean any offence, "much-much easier" is only in my mind and it's only my humble opinion. I believe that non-forced play (like play on VC2 threats in Gomoku/Renju) is mostly impossible in Pente so the game tree one has to calculate during the game is more narrow in general, that's why I have this opinion.
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Re: Open Challenge to All TB Pente Masters -- Financial Incentives
Posted:
May 31, 2026, 5:29 AM
Somehow my post got deleted. And watsus did too. And it wasn't me. So I dont know whose messing around with admin powers. Anyways im going to repost.
Yes im aware his name and about renju. Not aware that he still plays. As to pente solved. Hold that thought. Because I think im about to destroy some common main line solutions, possibly.
And even if not, I think Viktor and I would both have interest in boat pente. The only time I saw him come here, was to challenge me in boat pente. To show me a wedge p2 win. I assume he challenged because my step father invented boat pente, but unsure.
Further, I am aware watsu has dug pretty deep in boat wedge lines. So, it could be a fierce tourney.
And, in boat, I think I may be forced as P1 to not play N10 on second move. Which really shows how serious it could get.
Scire hostis animum - Intelligere ludum - Nosce te ipsum - Prima moventur conciliat - Nolite errare
